How I Make Work, Work

A searingly honest and incredibly meaningful no-holds-barred interview with my brilliant (and anonymous) friend

I have this best friend. She’s successful (although she’ll shudder reading that), she’s smart (I am proud to say that I think she’d actually agree with this one), and she’s driven (now she’s laughing though, she reckons she’s lazy). 

But, here’s the thing: even though she puts her best foot forward in her career, even though she engages in paid work full time, even though she’s good at what she does, she really doesn’t give a flying f*ck about work. She clocks on, does a good job, and clocks the hell back off. 

Instead, she has boundaries. She doesn’t pander to “the man” so to speak. Her identity is not bound to what she does for a living and she’s not consumed by it. There’s no ego attached to the signature at the bottom of each email she sends, because she’s far more proud of her other titles: daughter, friend, wife, mother. 

She doesn’t live to work. She works to live. 

And in a society that is so tied up in our own self importance – what we do, what we study, what we earn – my friend’s approach to paid work has been a breath of fresh air for me: a stark reminder that yes, it’s okay if work does in fact matter to you, but no, we shan’t let it matter that much.

Here, we talk about her reflections on early motherhood, her approach to paid work, what’s really important to her, and why we all need to care a bit less at work. 

Please use three words to introduce/describe yourself outside of being a mother and career girlie… 

Direct, caring and loyal.

Now, tell us about who you are as a mother and in business? 

As a mother, I think I’m loving, practical and deeply, deeply invested.

As a woman in business, I think I'm pragmatic, excellent at managing and organising my time (fitting as much into as little time as possible to afford me the flexibility I probably don’t deserve as a full-time employee) and passionate. 

You and I always speak about the fact that the lead up to milestones in motherhood is often far more feverish and anxiety inducing than actually moving through it. We both particularly noticed this when it came to the return to work.

Can you tell us about how you felt in the lead up to the return to work, and how it actually played out?

Yes, I think this is the one thing that has rung true for me in almost all aspects of motherhood. I give myself the most crippling anxiety and work myself into a state in the lead up to milestones (i.e. starting daycare, returning to work, leaving my daughter for the first time, teething, daylight savings, interrupting her very regimented sleep schedule for some freedom etc) and 9.5 times out of 10, it’s been an absolute breeze. 

I returned to work when my daughter was just over 12 months old. I was returning to a really familiar work environment, having worked for the business I’m employed by for over seven years now, knowing I had a supportive boss who had afforded me the flexibility of working from home and (for the first time in the history of our business) a four-day working week for the first three months. I started my daughter in childcare two days a week, two weeks before I returned. My daughter got her first serious cold the day I returned to work and I had a screaming, feverish, snotty, sad girl on my lap while I navigated Zoom meetings and hundreds of emails. My boss at the time said “delete anything that’s been sent to you before today, anyone who needs you can follow you up,” but I really need context in almost all facets of work. I’m my own worst enemy sometimes. 

On my third day back at work, I had a really important meeting with my boss, my boss’s boss and some other key stakeholders in our business that meant I had to leave my daughter for the day with my husband, who had to take the day off work. I remember voice memo’ing one of our girlfriends as I was driving to my meeting, BALLING my eyes out in search of support and assurance that my baby would be fine and that I would be too. I got it, but it didn't help much. 

From then on, nothing has seemed as hard about balancing work and mum life because it made me realise: I do not care about the big wigs in suits, proposing strategies and well thought out yearly plans that firstly, very rarely come to fruition and secondly, are very likely to change anyway. All I care about is my family and that my daughter knows how much I love her and that I would do anything for her. 

In many ways, experiencing motherhood can make paid work seem easier. In what ways has this been true for you?

In my experience, nothing will ever be as challenging as motherhood has been but equally, nothing has ever or will ever be as rewarding. My boss recently asked me what motivates me at work and when I thought about it, I genuinely couldn’t think of anything other than to say ‘money’. I work to earn money to live my life with my family and my friends. I genuinely, and deeply, do not care about work. I do it because I have to and because it pays my bills and affords me the life I choose to live.  

On the flip side, in what ways has paid work remained challenging?

Honestly, the most challenging thing about paid work for me is that I just think it's all a bit of a farce. I hate that I'm doing this job, working for this multi-BILLION dollar business that doesn’t pay me what I know I'm worth, while I'm paying for someone else to look after my daughter. This isn’t to say that I don’t value and love our childcare, but this paradox of working for someone that values me far less than my daughter does, does sit heavy with me. 

I try to work hard in my allotted hours, but I also find my mind wondering if I can quickly squeeze in a mop or a vacuum before my daughter comes home or if I've prepared enough for dinner or if I've done all the laundry. I know it's a bit of a buzz word/phrase, but the ‘mental load’ of being a full time, working mum and wife is A LOT. I have certain timelines and roadmaps I have to adhere to at work that don’t always work with motherhood and daily life and I certainly find that challenging. 

Additionally, my role is a national role and a role that has some pretty important stakeholders that don’t live in my state. One of the biggest challenges for me has been navigating travel for work and managing the guilt of leaving my family. It’s something that has to be done and whilst I’ve been very crafty in how I manage my hours at work and I do allow myself to switch off at 4pm (dont tell my boss that) to pick up my daughter from daycare, I'm still challenged at work every day because it's in my nature to always put my best foot forward. 

I’m still looking for that next promotion to put myself in the next pay bracket, I still want to improve our strategies and processes and I still want to be seen as a good employee. I care deeply what other people think of me. 

You’re about 20 months into motherhood now – what does parenthood feel like to you now compared to the early days? 

I'm an extremely structured and routine oriented person. I NEED it to feel like I'm in control and as anyone who’s had a baby will know, that's next to impossible with a newborn. I found it extremely difficult to get out of the house in the first few months of being a mum. My daughter’s cries would often physically hurt for me to hear and I was so bound by this sleep schedule I had given us both that I’d have one-hour windows every few hours to get out and see my friends. I tracked every single feed, every minute of sleep, every milestone and every day of my daughter's life for the first year and I now know how indicative of postpartum anxiety that is. While I think the schedule did pay off in the long run, and I've found my freedom and flexibility again, I think it came at a bigger cost to my mental health than I cared to admit in the early days. 

Now, it feels like a breeze and I genuinely think that's because I reflect on the early days and how hard I made them for myself. Now, I'm lucky enough to have a happy, healthy, beautiful daughter who is the light of my life and I could not be more proud to be her mama. Equally, I've found comfort in knowing she is in safe, entertaining hands at childcare and I've allowed myself to let go of a little control to afford her a little more freedom. 

Now, something I have heard you say often of work is that you “just don’t give enough of a f*ck” about paid work. And I f*cking love it. And I know that this in no way correlates with doing a bad job or not doing the work – you just have a great perspective and know what’s important. Can you tell me a bit more about this perspective? 

I used to think I was a career gal. I worked hard in my undergrad. I studied abroad for a year. I’ve learned to speak two languages fluently because I thought it would help me integrate into a global business better. I’m four subjects off finishing a masters in business (something I’ve paused while i navigate being a mum, wife, friend, employee, sister, daughter etc etc), I’ve had three promotions in two years and i was always the first person to put my hand up at work to lead big strategy projects. Since having my daughter, I’ve realised - im just another cog in the wheel and I just don’t give a f*ck about work. It’s not what's important to me right now. 

The month before I went on maternity leave, I spent most days detailing every project I was managing. I would run weekly WIPs with all of the teams I work cross functionally with and I wrote up a ‘bible’ for my successor. I remember telling work that they could call me at ANY time if they needed any help or guidance because I was so sure that the ship would crash without its captain. I was SO wrong. They didn't call me once and when I came back to my role it was a little worse for wear, but they made it through the year just fine. 

Motherhood has taught me a few important things but the biggest one has been - work doesn't NEED me like my daughter does. Work doesn't NEED my opinion or guidance like my daughter does. I am SO replaceable to the business I work for, but I am not for my daughter. 

And now teach us all how the f*ck we care less about these things we do for big corporates that kind of don’t give a f*ck about us? 

Perspective and reflection - this is terrible and so pessimistic, but I genuinely think about how little my work values me, almost every day. We’re all just these busy worker ants, busting our chops for this man who sits in an ivory tower, worth billions of dollars, while we slave away for just over the average yearly income in Australia as our cost of living explodes through the roof. 

As an employee in a business, I see remuneration as a reflection of a business’s value of its employees. I’ve often been told I should be grateful to work for the business that I do because the brands I work for are so incredible (and they are) but they do NOT pay my bills. My wages do. We are paid below market average because of the desirability of the business I work for and are often told that there are hundreds (if not thousands) of applications for roles when they come up. Additionally, we recently had to endure a presentation by our director of HR justifying our gender pay gap by explaining that it was because we had more males in senior leadership positions. Salt in the wound. She also then went on to congratulate one of my male colleagues for “supporting the gender pay gap” by taking four weeks paternity leave to “support his wife.” 

Honestly, I'm surprised and disappointed in myself that I still work for these assholes. All these little cuts are going to be the death of me one day but for now, I milk them for their maternity leave pay and long service leave and then I'm outta there. 

You recently got a promotion. Do you tie your self-worth to this at all or is it just nice to be under a little less financial pressure? How does a promotion make you feel?

I don't quite know how to articulate this in a way that's softer than - I really tie no self worth to my work achievements or accomplishments. I work to earn money to live my life, and whilst it's important to me that I'm doing something I enjoy (because i do genuinely enjoy what I do for work), my self-worth comes from what I can give my family and friends and what I accomplish and achieve outside of work. 

I am proud of the promotion I got, but to put it bluntly, it's more because it means we’re going to be under a little less financial pressure when I'm back on maternity leave than anything. I was really gunning for it because I knew what it could mean for my family. 

I also think in the business that I work for, we are always trying to deliver on the perception that we are SO busy. Busy busy busy. But ultimately, if you’re efficient and you manage your time effectively, a promotion doesn't necessarily mean more work, it just means a higher level of participation is often required and that's something I'm pretty comfortable with managing. 

Finally, I should add that through all of my pessimism, this is just how I'm feeling about work right now, 20 months into being a mum with a second baby on the way. It's not to say that work isn't going to be something I want to throw myself into when my babies need me less and I need to fill that gap – because I know there is going to eventually be one – but for now, work is just work. 

Why do you think everyone should care a little less about their paid work?

I think as mothers, daughters, friends, partners our self worth should come from our successes in relationships. For me, the meaning of life is to love and be loved. This isn’t to imply that you shouldn't care about paid work, but I think it’s important to try to care a little less, because it's not what you’re going to be remembered for when your time is up. 

You’re an organised person, what helps your weeks flow more smoothly?

ROUTINE and something fun planned for every weekend.

Additionally (and more boringly) I plan out all of our meals, do a weekly Woolies shop online, have it delivered and I try and cook dinners during the day at the start of the week and always make a large batch to freeze some of, for the days I just cannot be f*cked cooking. 

I also always have SO MANY BABY SNACKS ready which helps me to firstly drive in peace, and secondly, when my daughter is fed and full of healthy and nutritious food it makes everything feel easier. 

QUICKFIRE ROUND

Describe motherhood in three words. 

Testing, exhilarating and fulfilling.

Navigating motherhood and paid work is…

Challenging – it’s never going to be easy but once you find your groove, stick to what you believe in and what you know is best for you and your family. Be selfish, just like your business would be to protect its own interests. 

I wouldn’t be able to navigate motherhood and paid work without… 

My family and my friends – their support, guidance, advice and love is invaluable 

My go-to mum-friendly work uniform is…

Black wide leg pants, a black top and slides. It's probably embarrassing how much I try plug DISSH with my friends and family but it's all so affordable and comfortable. When in doubt, wear black and remember: everyone is too self obsessed and absorbed to remember what you wore last Tuesday. 

The best way to help a new mum is…

Food 

The best way to help a mum returning to paid work is…

Offer your experience if they ask for it. Be waiting on the sidelines to pick up the emotional pieces after a hard day of work. Remind them how amazing they are and that what they are doing is incredibly selfless and WINE TIME. 

If I could solve one problem for working mothers, it would be… 

Ensuring all working mothers have better/longer maternity leave pay to alleviate financial pressures on young families and abolishing the superannuation gap. 

To get out of the door in the morning, I need…

A smooch and a cuddle from my daughter (and sometimes my husband when he’s not being a pain in me ass). 

My biggest current challenge in making work, work as a mum is…

Trying to find the motivation to not tell everyone to ‘get f*cked’ when they ask me for help? No, just kidding. My current challenge is navigating various personalities at work who struggle to delegate, and wanting to be busy during work hours to justify my guilt of sending my daughter to childcare but not wanting to overload myself in the lead up to big changes in our family. 

My biggest focus for 2024 is… 

My family – we have a new addition due later this year, which I'm sure comes with a whole ‘nother set of challenges.

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I hope you love this new column! I sure love creating them and I can’t wait to explore this with more mothers. In the meantime, shop our Go To Guides here, follow us on Instagram here and listen to the podcast here.

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